Infiniti Q45 oil pan removal procedure

[N. Harriet]

Do you know how to drop a 1993 Infiniti Q45 oil pan?

A biker dropped his pannier in front of me on the freeway.
After dragging the saddlebag for 100 yards, I ran out of oil.
Turns out I gouged and dented my Q45 oilpan beyond repair.
I went down below but can't figure out how to drop that oil pan.
So much heavy duty suspension stuff seems to be in the way.

Anyone have a description of what the steps are?
How long is the shop rating?

[Miki]

The first step in the service manual says: "Remove engine."

You may not have to remove it, you could probably jack it up. You
would likely have to lift it until it's against the firewall, because
the pan needs quite a few inches of drop-down before it'll clear the
crank counterweights.

[N. Harriet]

Post by Miki
The first step in the service manual says: "Remove engine."

Are you sure? What manual are you looking at? All Infiniti Q45 cars seem to
come with a shop manual in the trunk, so everyone has one.The shop manual
I have does NOT state to remove the engine in the oilpan removal section.

The bad news is the shop manual only has two pages on the process.
1= Remove engine under cover
2= Drain engine oil
3= Remove fan coupling with fan
4= Remove the following parts
(all drive belts, alternator, air compressor, engine gusset)
5= Remove steering lower joint
6= Set a suitable transmission jack under the transmission.
Hoist engine with engine slinger.
7= Remove suspension member assembly
8= Remove oil pan bolts and nuts
9= Remove oil pan

A lot appears to be missing from the shop manual (which is typical). Just
looking at that front engine crossmember gives me the willies. It must have
dozens of bolts with steering and suspension parts and wires all over the
place.

If anyone has written a good guide to an oil pan removal, pleaes let me know.

[AZGuy]

Post by N. Harriet
Do you know how to drop a 1993 Infiniti Q45 oil pan?
A biker dropped his pannier in front of me on the freeway.
After dragging the saddlebag for 100 yards, I ran out of oil.
Turns out I gouged and dented my Q45 oilpan beyond repair.
I went down below but can't figure out how to drop that oil pan.
So much heavy duty suspension stuff seems to be in the way.
Anyone have a description of what the steps are?
How long is the shop rating?

Shouldn't either his or your insurance cover this???
--
Elbridge Gerry, of Massachusetts:

"What, sir, is the use of militia? It is to prevent the
establishment of a standing army, the bane of liberty. . .
Whenever Government means to invade the rights and liberties of
the people, they always attempt to destroy the militia, in order
to raise a standing army upon its ruins." -- Debate, U.S. House
of Representatives, August 17, 1789

[Hagrinas Mivali]

Post by AZGuy

Post by N. Harriet
Do you know how to drop a 1993 Infiniti Q45 oil pan?
A biker dropped his pannier in front of me on the freeway.
After dragging the saddlebag for 100 yards, I ran out of oil.
Turns out I gouged and dented my Q45 oilpan beyond repair.
I went down below but can't figure out how to drop that oil pan.
So much heavy duty suspension stuff seems to be in the way.
Anyone have a description of what the steps are?
How long is the shop rating?

Shouldn't either his or your insurance cover this???

...

That depends on the insurance. The other guy's insurance should cover this,
assuming he has insurance, and his identity is known. If not, it could be
covered by uninsured motorist property damage or comprehensive, depending on
the circumstances, if that type of coverage exists.

[fweddybear]

Post by N. Harriet
Do you know how to drop a 1993 Infiniti Q45 oil pan?
A biker dropped his pannier in front of me on the freeway.
After dragging the saddlebag for 100 yards, I ran out of oil.
Turns out I gouged and dented my Q45 oilpan beyond repair.
I went down below but can't figure out how to drop that oil pan.
So much heavy duty suspension stuff seems to be in the way.

What does it say in the manual?? These things come in handy and I can't
stress enough how important it is to have one for each car you own
especially if you intend to do work on it.

Fwed

[q45yesman]

I'd be very surprised if a 1993 is insured against collision & theft.

You need to drop the oil pan out the bottom.
You do NOT need to remove the Q45 VH45DE engine.
But, you do need to unbolt the two motor mounts.
So you MUST support the engine from above!
Otherwise, you'll be crushed when you remove the front crossmember.
To remove the front crossmember the suspension links come off.
The transverse link must be removed to access crossmember bolts.
Leave the steering rack hanging once you remove the crossmember.
Mechanics can do this in a day.
DIY will take a few weekends as you're essentially removing the engine.
Most of the time you also have to remove the front engine gusset.
That adds about 5 more hours to the job.
That's because the alternator & compressor are bolted to the gusset.
The fan and all the belts have to come off to unbolt these two units.
Remove two rear engine gussets and the flywheel plate.
Support the transmission but leave the tranny mount intact.
You also have to disconnect the steering u-joint just above the rack.
While you're there you may as well replace the two engine mounts.
Also replace the two steering rack bushings while you're already there.
Some replace the alternator while they have it out.
You do not ever wish to remove an alternator after once doing it once.
Only 18 bolts hold the Q45 oil pan onto the engine.
While you're there look for chain guide parts in the oilpan.
Almost all 1990 to 1993 Qs will have lost their chain guides by now.
You can get a kit from Joe at Scottsdale (www.everythingnissan.com).
They are the best price Infiniti parts dealership in the world by far.
If you don't replace those guides you will lose your engine eventually.
Timing chains slip teeth & valves tap dance on your piston head.
Guides & oil pan almost always come in pairs.
Button it all up with RTV red & locktite red and you're all set.
Simple.

The whole procedure is explained on the Nissan Infiniti Club site
www.nicoclub.com

[Hagrinas Mivali]

Post by q45yesman
I'd be very surprised if a 1993 is insured against collision & theft.

I have a 1991 that's insured against collision and theft. I also have a
$1000 deductible. The extra coverage cost very little. The replacement
cost for my vehicle through a dealer in my area with my low mileage is
$5,648. Considering that the slightest damage can cost a few thousand
dollars these days, it's been worth it for me. Since the vehicle was new,
my wife has had two minor scrapes with it. They were both expensive to fix,
both well over $1000, and both low enough that they did not raise my rates.
The most recent one was within the past year. The payment I got made up for
the premiums. Had I dropped collision five years ago, or even more, I would
not have saved enough money to have made up for what it would have cost
without it.

Also, many people get insurance when the vehicle is new and just send in a
check when the bill comes without thinking about it. If the extra amount
added up to hundreds of dollars, perhaps I'd consider dropping it.

[N. Harriet]

Post by Hagrinas Mivali

Post by q45yesman
I'd be very surprised if a 1993 is insured against collision & theft.

I have a 1991 that's insured against collision and theft. I also have a
$1000 deductible. The extra coverage cost very little.

Wow. I want to live in your state!

Even though I have a clean record, my insurance agent quoted over a thousand
dollars a year additional to cover the twelve year old Q45 for damage. Maybe
it's because I have twin driving age teenagers at home but it sure looked as
if the insurance company really didn't want to insure the vehicle and neither
did I once they quoted those yearly premiums.

The good news is that these Q45s are bullet proof. You just can't kill those
engines!

[Hagrinas Mivali]

Post by N. Harriet

Post by Hagrinas Mivali

Post by q45yesman
I'd be very surprised if a 1993 is insured against collision & theft.

I have a 1991 that's insured against collision and theft. I also
have a $1000 deductible. The extra coverage cost very little.

Wow. I want to live in your state!

Insurance is cheap in my state only if you have a clean record. Otherwise,
it's very expensive.

Teenagers can drive up rates, especially if they are boys. In my state,
driving record, miles driven, and number of years driving are all factors.
Age alone, sex, or zip code are not supposed to be factors -- if your area
has many accidents but you don't, then why should you pay more? But in other
states, sex and age are factors too. When I was growing up, many women of
my mom's generation did not drive. Women paid less for insurance. When I
got my license, my household had two male drivers under 25. That made one
of us the primary driver for one vehicle. So my mom got a license. She
never drove again, but it kept our insurance down.

[N. Harriet]

Post by q45yesman
I'd be very surprised if a 1993 is insured against collision & theft.

It isn't. I didn't think anyone insured a ten year old Q.

Post by q45yesman
The whole procedure is explained on the Nissan Infiniti Club site
www.nicoclub.com

I just looked. That web site is awesome! More about Nissan and Infiniti
cars that all of the usenet combined. But I didn't find the oil pan removal
procedure in the search. Do you have a better link?

[Steve]

Post by q45yesman
I'd be very surprised if a 1993 is insured against collision & theft.
You need to drop the oil pan out the bottom.
You do NOT need to remove the Q45 VH45DE engine.

<snip>

Wow. I wouldn'a thought it possible. A car sufficiently convoluted that
it makes service procedures for a Northstar Cadillac appear logical.

[Hagrinas Mivali]

Post by Steve

Post by q45yesman
I'd be very surprised if a 1993 is insured against collision & theft.
You need to drop the oil pan out the bottom.
You do NOT need to remove the Q45 VH45DE engine.

<snip>
Wow. I wouldn'a thought it possible. A car sufficiently convoluted
that it makes service procedures for a Northstar Cadillac appear
logical.

The Q45 is the only vehicle I know of that sends techicians' heads spining
when they have to figure out how to change the oil.

[N. Harriet]

Post by fweddybear
What does it say in the manual?? These things come in handy and I can't
stress enough how important it is to have one for each car you own

A factory shop manual comes with every Q45 sold AFAIK. It's built like a
boxer three inches thick but only four inches wide by six inches long with
print only someone under 30 can actually read.

That one line that says "remove suspension member assembly" must be a
japanese joke because there are a hundred things attached to that frame member
including steering, suspension, motor mounts, and tons of hoses and electrical
wires.

I'll bet those engineers are still laughing today about writing that stuff up
in the early nineties.

[N. Harriet]

Post by Hagrinas Mivali

Post by AZGuy

Post by N. Harriet
A biker dropped his pannier in front of me on the freeway.
After dragging the saddlebag for 100 yards, I ran out of oil.
Turns out I gouged and dented my Q45 oilpan beyond repair.

Shouldn't either his or your insurance cover this???

That depends on the insurance.

All I have is liability. Nothing else.
I didn't think anyone covers a car once it hit eight to ten years, do they?

[Hagrinas Mivali]

Post by N. Harriet

Post by Hagrinas Mivali

Post by AZGuy

Post by N. Harriet
A biker dropped his pannier in front of me on the freeway.
After dragging the saddlebag for 100 yards, I ran out of oil.
Turns out I gouged and dented my Q45 oilpan beyond repair.

Shouldn't either his or your insurance cover this???

That depends on the insurance.

All I have is liability. Nothing else.
I didn't think anyone covers a car once it hit eight to ten years, do they?

Absolutely, but you have to weigh the cost against the benefits. Once the
book value sinks, it's often not worth it. A typical 10 year old car is
worth $1-2000. If you want something affordable, you need a high deductible.
If you have insurance for a $1000 car with a $1000 deductible, then in
theory, you would never collect, because the car would be considered totaled
if the damage exceeds book value. If it's worth $2000, and insurance cost an
extra $300/year, then unless you think there's a 1 in 3 chance of a serious
accident, it's still not worth it. Since insurance companies never pay more
than what a car is worth, it could be considered totalled if somebody steals
a radio.

I live in an area of the US where cars are expensive, and so is insurance.
But comprehensive is about $50, and collision is about $80. My book value
is close to $6000, and my insurance company is pretty good at paying what it
would cost me to get a similar vehicle in my area.

I don't know what it costs to have a dealer replace an oil pan, but I know
it can cost $300-400 to have a simple hose replaced under some
circumstances. If this happened to me, I'd still be out at most $1000, but
I suspect that the part that the insurance company would pay would be
greater than my comprehensive payments.

If there were another driver involved and he was responsible, then he would
have to pay. But if he had no insurance, then my "uninsured motor vehicle
property damage" insurance would cover that. That cost me $3.65 on my
policy. In theory, the insurance company would still go after the other
person, but it would not be my problem.

Even without insurance, if you know who the other person is, he's probably
responsible. There's always small claims court.

[E. Meyer]

Post by Hagrinas Mivali

Post by AZGuy

Post by N. Harriet
Do you know how to drop a 1993 Infiniti Q45 oil pan?
A biker dropped his pannier in front of me on the freeway.
After dragging the saddlebag for 100 yards, I ran out of oil.
Turns out I gouged and dented my Q45 oilpan beyond repair.
I went down below but can't figure out how to drop that oil pan.
So much heavy duty suspension stuff seems to be in the way.
Anyone have a description of what the steps are?
How long is the shop rating?

Shouldn't either his or your insurance cover this???

That depends on the insurance. The other guy's insurance should cover this,
assuming he has insurance, and his identity is known. If not, it could be
covered by uninsured motorist property damage or comprehensive, depending on
the circumstances, if that type of coverage exists.

...

Depends where you live. Here in Texas the law is very clear that anything
you hit is your own fault, not the fault of the guy who dropped it ahead of
you. So, if you live here, it will be a claim against your own insurance.

[Hagrinas Mivali]

Post by E. Meyer

Post by Hagrinas Mivali

Post by AZGuy

Post by N. Harriet
Do you know how to drop a 1993 Infiniti Q45 oil pan?
A biker dropped his pannier in front of me on the freeway.
After dragging the saddlebag for 100 yards, I ran out of oil.
Turns out I gouged and dented my Q45 oilpan beyond repair.
I went down below but can't figure out how to drop that oil pan.
So much heavy duty suspension stuff seems to be in the way.
Anyone have a description of what the steps are?
How long is the shop rating?

Shouldn't either his or your insurance cover this???

That depends on the insurance. The other guy's insurance should
cover this, assuming he has insurance, and his identity is known. If
not, it could be covered by uninsured motorist property damage or
comprehensive, depending on the circumstances, if that type of
coverage exists.

Depends where you live. Here in Texas the law is very clear that
anything you hit is your own fault, not the fault of the guy who
dropped it ahead of you. So, if you live here, it will be a claim
against your own insurance.

...

It's not that way where I live. In some cases, I was surprised at the
rules. If you hit an animal here, it's always covered by comprehensive, for
example. I can see why it should not be your fault if a deer jumps out of
nowhere, or if you hit a boulder that rolled off a hill right in front of
you, but I had assumed it would depend a lot more on the circumstances.
Also, glass damage is always out of comprehensive here, no matter what
caused the damage. (There may be some fine print saying that if you break it
on purpose, they won't pay, but it's almost always true.)

Such laws often depend little on what's right or wrong but on which party
controls the legislature. If something is unavoidable, it cannot reasonably
be your fault. But if big business comes ahead of consumer rights, then
that's the price you pay.

I suppose that one could argue that if you are keeping a safe following
distance, then if you slam on your brakes when you see something flying, you
will not hit it. The insurance of the person who hits you will pay for
damage to your car when you get rear ended, and your basic medical bills
will be paid for, but nobody will pay for your life of pain.

[N. Harriet]

Post by AZGuy
Shouldn't either his or your insurance cover this???

If you see a guy with a helmet and Aerostitch on a big black BMW with only one
saddlebag, tell him I'm looking for him. He owes me some money. Plus when he
gets home, he's going to want all that stuff that must've been in that
saddlebag (I found gray toshiba portable computer parts all over my engine and
ladies underthings .. no kiddin).

[Steve]

Post by N. Harriet

Post by AZGuy
Shouldn't either his or your insurance cover this???

If you see a guy with a helmet and Aerostitch on a big black BMW with only one
saddlebag, tell him I'm looking for him. He owes me some money. Plus when he
gets home, he's going to want all that stuff that must've been in that
saddlebag (I found gray toshiba portable computer parts all over my engine and
ladies underthings .. no kiddin).

I can see how the toshiba parts could have gotten all over the engines,
but how did they get on your ladies underthings?

(sorry, never can resist a grammatical joke...)

:-)

[Steve T]

Post by N. Harriet
Do you know how to drop a 1993 Infiniti Q45 oil pan?
A biker dropped his pannier in front of me on the freeway.
After dragging the saddlebag for 100 yards, I ran out of oil.
Turns out I gouged and dented my Q45 oilpan beyond repair.
I went down below but can't figure out how to drop that oil pan.
So much heavy duty suspension stuff seems to be in the way.

Exactly, most of these types of cars need at least the front crossmember
lowered to get the pan off. Never done a Q but all the later Z cars are
like this.

[q45yesman]

Post by N. Harriet

Post by q45yesman
The whole procedure is explained on the Nissan Infiniti Club site
www.nicoclub.com

I just looked. That web site is awesome!
More about Nissan and Infiniti cars that all of the usenet
But I didn't find the oil pan removal procedure
Do you have a better link?

It's there. Keep looking. Skip all the Nissan stuff.
Look near the bottom of the www.nicoclub.com web page.
Go directly to the "Infiniti Online Mechanic" section.
http://www.nicoclub.com/zeroforum?id=24
The Infiniti online mechanics there walk you through any repair.
These NICO technicians are open day & night 24/7 & don't cost a dime.
The home boys who post are of the best quality you can imagine.
The Q45 oil pan r&r & the Q45 chainguide r&r are all linked.
While the radiator is out of the Q45 - add a tranny cooler.
The OEM tranny cooler is as worthless as the OEM chainguides.
While you're there, everyone replaces the useless ATF cooler.
Everyone adds new steering rack bushings as you are already there.
Same with motor mounts as they attach the engine to the crossmember.
You'll almost certainly want to do a plenum job while you're there.
Also beef up the fuel pump control unit with a simple rewire.
Replace your speedometer voltmeter as they always seem to go.
Replenish your A/C and replace your Bose speakers under recall.
After these mandatory modifications your older Q45 lasts forever.
You get a 60 thousand dollar car for the sales tax on a new Q45.
It's all there on the www.nissaninfiniticlub.com web site.
All of us moved over from usenet and yahoo message boards ages ago.

[q45yesman]

The Q45 olipan r&r is meticulously documented at www.nicoclub.com
http://www.nicoclub.com/zerothread?id=77266

[unknown]

Post by N. Harriet
Do you know how to drop a 1993 Infiniti Q45 oil pan?
A biker dropped his pannier in front of me on the freeway.
After dragging the saddlebag for 100 yards, I ran out of oil.
Turns out I gouged and dented my Q45 oilpan beyond repair.
I went down below but can't figure out how to drop that oil pan.
So much heavy duty suspension stuff seems to be in the way.
Anyone have a description of what the steps are?
How long is the shop rating?

hey, my friend is looking at getting one of these and I stumbled across
this link which you might find of use:

http://www.nissaninfiniticlub.com/zerothread?id=77266

[Cdon]

http://www.nissaninfiniticlub.com/zerothread?id=77266

Better to use the http://www.nicoclub.com link than the older outdated
http://www.nissaninfiniticlub.com link which is no longer maintained
nor supported.

Your same link translates to
http://www.nicoclub.com/zerothread?id=77266 for that verrrrry complete
oil pan article by Tangalora (who is famous for her detailed step by
step how tos on the nico web site).

She also has how tos on redesigning the Q45 sunvisor, redesigning the
fuel pump control unit, doing a complete front and rear brake job
including checking runout, replacing antennas, replacing the timing
chains, and I think a host of others as I don't remember them all.
Good luck!

[J. S. Miller]

Post by Cdon
Better to use the http://www.nicoclub.com link

I just replaced my fuel pump and soldered a new wire on my fuel pump control
unit saving about 500 dollars in parts and about 500 dollars in labor at the
local rates here (@100 dollars an hour).

Those Infiniti Q45 fuel pump repair instructions on that web site just saved
me a thousand bucks!

Now I'm going to replace my plenum, spark plugs, and chain guides next (all of
which are 10 hour jobs each).

[stuart8181]

How in the world could a fuel pump replacement be 5 hours in time cost???

Post by J. S. Miller

Post by Cdon
Better to use the http://www.nicoclub.com link

I just replaced my fuel pump and soldered a new wire on my fuel pump control
unit saving about 500 dollars in parts and about 500 dollars in labor at the
Those Infiniti Q45 fuel pump repair instructions on that web site just saved
me a thousand bucks!
Now I'm going to replace my plenum, spark plugs, and chain guides next (all of
which are 10 hour jobs each).

[q45yesman]

How in the world could a Q45 fuel pump replacement take 5 hours?

For the complete Q45 fuel pump removal and replacement procedures, see
http://www.nicoclub.com/zerothread?id=6268

Basically the early model Q45 fuel pumps go slowly at around 100K
miles.
You can tell when its going bad as it begins to hum.
If you ever hear a Q45 fuel pump then you should replace it
IMMEDIATELY!
While the Q45 fuel pump is humming, its slowly frying the fpcu.
The fuel pump is about 250 dollars.
The fuel pump control unit costs much more.
If you just replace the fuel pump, the degraded fpcu will fry the new
pump.
You will be caught in a vicious cycle (about six months in duration).
When the fpcu finally goes, the Q45 stops dead in its tracks (well, it
rolls).
Therefore, think of the fuel pump and the fpcu as an integrated unit.

So part of any good Q45 fuel pump job consists of repairing the fpcu.
You can ONLY remove the early Q45 fuel pump & fpcu by removing the back
seat.
Yet you must access the fuel pump & components from the cargo area.

In the cargo area, remove the passenger siding near the antenna.
Test & replace the fuel pump relay (bolted next to the rear antenna).
The relay is the green one (not the blue relay as often reported).

From the cargo area, remove the siding in front of the fuel tank.

Follow the shop manual procedures for testing fuel pump & fpcu
operation.
Inspect all fuel lines and harness connections (replace if necessary).
Remove the brackets holding the fuel pump fuel lines in place.

From the back seat, you generally remove the rear seat belts.

Then remove the rear seat bench.
Remove the rear arm rest storage bin.
Remove the rear seat back.
Remove the rear third stop light.
Remove the rear sundeck.
Remove the rear package binnacle.
Scrape away the black sound proofing tar above the fpcu.
Remove the fuel pump control unit brackets and remove the fpcu.
Remove the cover to the fuel pump control unit taking static
precautions.
Check all wiring and electrical contacts on your electrical bench.
Most likely you'll need to solder supporting wires as shown on nico.
After adding support wires to the fpcu, test again on your bench.

Back in the cargo area position yourself on your side facing forward.
Remove the fuel pump out the hole left by the rear package binnacle.
Inspect the gas tank for rust or other contaminants.
If contaminated, drop the gas tank and flush or repair accordingly.

On your shop bench, remove all brackets, fittings, and hoses from the
fp.
Replace those brackets hoses and filters onto the new fuel pump.
Replace the fuel pump o ring in the Q45 gasoline tank.
Bolt the new fuel pump onto the tank (going in the same way it came
out).
Reassemble cargo & rear seat components in the reverse order of
assembly.

How long would it take you to do this Q45 fuel pump replacement
correctly?

[Alessandro Crugnola]

Post by q45yesman

How in the world could a Q45 fuel pump replacement take 5 hours?

For the complete Q45 fuel pump removal and replacement procedures, see
http://www.nicoclub.com/zerothread?id=6268

I must do that in less than hour if best done.